2025 Inductees & Snubs-- an update

The 2025 Inductees to the Rock Hall were just announced, so let's take a look at how well the Hall did at inducting those of the type they have hitherto snubbed.

Last year, I listed those nominated-but-not-inducted separately. This time, I will add them where there SHOULD have gone, but in [brackets]:

1950s: Chubby Checker (I think of him as a one-hit wonder, but OK)

1980s: Cyndi Lauper, Salt-N-Pepa [Billy Idol, Joy Division/New Order]

Rap: Outkast, Salt-N-Pepa

Arena Rock: hmm... Bad Company are more classic rock than arena rock

Blues: None

Country: None (but it should not be a priority anyway)

Hard Rock/Heavy Metal: Bad Company, The White Stripes, Soundgarden [Black Crowes, Billy Idol, Oasis]

Folk: None. Warren Zevon was a singer-songwriter, but not a folk one. [Same with Ian Curtis.]

Disco: None. Well, maybe some of Thom Bell's R&B work counts. Is it pre-disco? 

Guitar Gods: None. The above-mentioned Hard Rock acts all have vocals.

Lighter Soul: OK, here Thom Bell definitely counts, even as a non-performer.

Novelty: None. I mean... if you stretch the definition, maybe The Twist and Push It are novelty songs.

Non-English Language: None. Still. [Mana, from Mexico, was nominated at least!]

"Influences": If I still had hair to spare, I'd tear some out. HOW is Warren Zevon just an "influence?" He was a Performer. Did he play stadiums? No, but neither did Randy Newman or Tom Waits, and they are in as Performers. 
And Salt-N-Pepa DID play stadiums! This is a really inappropriate way to treat pioneering women of color. This is beyond insulting-- it's shameful. I hope there is a backlash. Outkast released their first album in 1994. Salt-N-Pepa dropped their first album in 1986.

Jam Bands: None. [Phish]

New Wave: Cyndi Lauper [JD/NO; Billy Idol, maybe?]

Longshots/Fringe Acts: Warren Zevon [JD/NO]

Singer/Not-Songwriter: Joe Cocker; he did write and co-write some of his songs, but his signature songs were covers. [Mariah Carey]

"Smart": Zevon. Maybe White Stripes and OutKast count. [JD/NO]

Piano: Warren Zevon. He was not known for his playing the same way, say, Billy Joel or Steve Winwood are, but it was his primary instrument.

Synth: None. 

Backing Bands: None have the "and the" that I mean.

Behind the Scenes: One Ertegun winner, Lenny Waronker, and well-deserved.

Singles: Still no new ones inducted

Women: Three! Cyndi Lauper as a performer, Meg White as part of The White Stripes, and iconic session bassist/Wrecking Crew member Carol Kaye for Musical Excellence. So glad Kaye got in while she is still kickin'-- she's 90! 

OK, the also-rans... here's the deal:

Black Crowes: I never thought they really had a chance. Their big hit is an Otis Redding cover.

Mariah Carey: Oh, she'll get in. She was snubbed two years running, but she'll get in.

Billy Idol: I thought he had a shot.

Joy Division/New Order: They will get in when the Xers take over.

Phish: You know the book "He's Just Not Into You?" That's the Rock Hall's book about jam bands.

Oasis: They will get in. At some point, all the 1990s rock acts-- rock's last gasp-- will get in. I mean, both Soundgarden and White Stripes made it this year.

Mana: Hey, at least the Hall is thinking outside the English-language box...

When I first started this mad endeavor, I made a list of all the acts who-- taking into account all of these snubbed genres and sub-genres-- should get in. I am pleased to report that it grows ever shorter.

2024 Inductees & Snubs-- an update

I wrote the majority of the posts of this blog in 2020. Since then, I have updated the posts in response to the latest years' inductees in the categories outlined in each individual post. For example, I updated the post about women (not) being inducted by updating that post with the women who were inducted in 2021, 2022, and 2023.

By now, those posts are very long. The 2024 inductees were recently announced, but rather than update those posts and make them even longer (and longer again in 2025) I have decided to add new posts each year to track how the Rock Hall is doing in fixing the problems I had outlined in 2020, regarding those genres and eras that have gone under-recognized.

1950s: No Performers inducted. At this point, they may be done inducting anyone from this time as anything more than an Influence, but not a Performer. 

1980s: Foreigner, Kool & the Gang (both also had hits in the 1970s)

Rap: A Tribe Called Quest

Arena Rock: Foreigner. I guess Peter Frampton could count here.

Blues: No Performers inducted, but some were inducted as "Influences": Alexis Korner, John Mayall, and Big Mama Thornton

Country: No Performers inducted, but I imagine they are taking a break after inducting Willie Nelson last year and Dolly Parton the year before that. 

Hard Rock/Metal: Ozzy Osbourne. He had previously been inducted as a member of Black Sabbath in 2006.

Folk: No Performers inducted. They may be done with inducting folk musicians, unless Suzanne Vega or Tracy Chapman make it in at some point. This is a crime, as many more deserve to be inducted than have been.

Disco: Cher, although she has performed many other styles as well. Kool & the Gang may count. 

Guitar Gods: No Performers inducted, in that I am only counting those whose albums are mostly instrumental (while Frampton sings).

Lighter Soul: Kool & the Gang

Novelty: No Performers inducted. Just as always.

Non-English language: Nope. Same.

"Later" Influences: Well, they went and did away with the "Early Influences" idea so they could induct acts like Gil Scott-Heron (who was an early influence, just of rap, not rock) and Kraftwerk (same, but of electronic music, not rock). And they renamed the category just "Musical Influences" (yawn).
But instead of honoring this idea they went and inducted John Mayall as an "Influence" instead of a "Performer" rendering this as ANOTHER DUMPING GROUND for acts that ALMOST-BUT-NOT QUITE made the cut as "Performers." 

Early Influences: Big Mama Thornton. Not that this category exists anymore. See above.

Jam Bands: No Performers inducted.

New Wave: No Performers inducted.

Longshots/Fringe acts: A Tribe Called Quest. I would have guessed many other rap acts would have gotten in before them. Also Alexis Korner. 

Singer (not songwriter): Dionne Warwick, in the Musical Excellence category. Which is wrong twice over-- one, she's a Performer, not Side(wo)man. Two, she doesn't belong in the Rock Hall at all. Her music has no place here. It's not about "is this rock?" but "does this rock?" and no, her music does not rock at all; it is so mainstream as to be the polar opposite of rock. I blame her presence here on the induction of Carly Simon; I like her music, but it barely rocks. Who's next, Barry Manilow? Lawrence Welk? 

"Smart": A Tribe Called Quest 

Piano: No Performers inducted

Synth: Foreigner? I hear mostly guitars from them, although they have a keyboardist.

Backing Bands: Both Kool and his Gang got in. 

Behind the Scenes: Yes! And a woman this time.

Singles: Still no new ones inducted.

Women: Here, they did well-- Cher, Mary J. Blige (Performers, snubbing Mariah Carey, Sade, and Sinead O'Connor [I thought her a shoo-in]). Plus more in all other categories. 

Speaking of other categories....

Musical Excellence-- another shitshow this year. NONE of those inducted in this category should be here:
-Jimmy Buffet sold out arenas for decades. He belongs in Performers, not here-- especially since the Dave Matthews Band, which does a lot of the same things, made it as a Performer.
-Detroit punks The MC5 got dumped here after being nominated SIX times as Performers (see also, Nile Rogers of Chic) which means they belong there.
-Dionne Warwick, I am sure a nice person, but as I said her music is not rebellious, edgy, grassroots, or in any way rock-like.
-Norman Whitfield belongs with his fellow songwriters, in the Non-Performer category, as he is best known as a Motown songwriter. 

Musical Influence-- The new name is too close to, and hereafter will forever be confused with by the public, Musical Excellence (see also: Album/Record of the Year at the Grammys). Especially since its inductees are ALSO no longer easily distinguishable as early influences to rock (or a rock-adjacent genre), but also people like John Mayall who SHOULD be inducted AS PERFORMERS. I mean, DUH. That said, Big Mama Thornton belongs here (and should have been inducted here ages ago) and so does Alexis Korner-- whom now will become familiar to at least a few more people. Which is also part of the Hall's purpose. 

Non-Performer-- There was one this year, which is great. And it was a woman, which is awesome. Her name is Suzanne de Passe. She is not the first woman inductee in this category; by my count, she is the fourth, the second inducted on her own (and not as part of a man-woman songwriting team). 

In sum, the Musical Excellence category remains the biggest problem that needs fixing. And the Musical Influence one is also becoming problematic just as they were starting to fix it.

As to those nominated who did not get in this time?
-Mariah Carey-- it would not have been her and Cher in the same year, and Cher has to go first.

-Eric B & Rakim-- longshots. Best bet would be a Musical Influence or maybe Excellence; not even LL COOL J got in as a Performer.

-Lenny Kravitz-- His day will come.

-Jane's Addiction-- Them, too. The '90s will do better once the Boomers leave and the Xers take over nominations.

-Sinead O'Connor-- Damn. Not even dying can get her in.

-Sade-- A one-hit wonder. Why was she even nominated?

-Oasis-- See Jane's Addiction above.

Final Note: The Chemical Brothers have been nominated 4 times. Look for them as future inductees-- in the Excellence or Influence "Miss Congeniality"-type categories. 

Missed Congeniality

Update: More injustices have been heaped into this "category." In 2021, the Award was used as intended to induct Billy Preston and Randy Rhoads, both impressive but, in fairness, mostly sidemen.
And then also... LL Cool J? Are you kidding me? Whom exactly, did he accompany? I have seen him perform, and he was able to command the whole stage himself just fine. He's one of the youngest recipients ever of the Kennedy Center Honors-- he's good enough for the Library of Congress but not the Rock Hall? He's been given performance awards by the The Grammys, Soul Train, MTV, BET, and the NAACP-- but he's not good enough for the Rock Hall?!
If RUN-DMC gets full Induction, so does LL. How the entire rap community did not protest this, I have no idea.

And then this year, 2022. Jimmy Jam & Terry Lewis get it, and they also deserve the Ertegun as producers, but in a way this lesser award is sweeter because it recognizes their amazing musicianship.
But then the Musical Excellence award went to Judas Priest, one of the seminal metal acts. I know, and I have said, the Hall has a problem with metal, but this is not the way to deal with it. Just induct bands in the category where bands go, please! To their credit, Priest is acting thrilled they are in, not upset at being only half-in. But this is Otto the Bus Driver's favorite band-- doesn't that count for anything?
Plenty of deserving accompanists are going-- staying-- unrecognized and unappreciated because of these shenanigans. Deserving acts are getting insulted and deserving sidemen and -women are being ignored altogether. 

FIX THIS. Or at least STOP DOING IT. It's EMBARRASSING. 

In 2023, they Inducted Chaka Khan for Musical Excellence. Again, she's a Performer, and one that has been nominated multiple times. Is this the Hall's plan, going forward, for dealing with those who are nominated over and over (and over-- I think 8 times for her [with Rufus and solo], 11 for Chic with Nile)? To let them in... sorta? Give baby his bottle, throw the dog a bone?

The other ones in 2023 are fine. Al Kooper is in as the Sideman he is. Bernie Taupin is FINALLY in, also for Musical Excellence. He's not a Performer, but he's responsible for writing some of the best and most important rock songs. So this is the category used as intended. Sheesh. 

In the Fringes… Not in the Hall

A page in a sociology textbook shows two photos— one of businesspeople in suits and ties, and one of hippies in fringed vests and bellbottom jeans. The caption for both?

“Conformity.”

Even nonconformists tend to conform… to each other. They rebel in the same way, forming their own norms. As my college roommate, who showed me the textbook, put it, “What if I totally believed everything the hippies did, but felt most comfortable in a rugby shirt and khakis? Wouldn’t that be truly rebellious?”

How many acts in the Rock Hall are truly like no other, in the Hall or outside it? Yes, many acts are unique, but they still fall within certain parameters.

Their songs have verses and choruses. And a 2/4 or 4/4 beat. And they use guitars, basses, drums, and keys.

Truly “out there” acts, where the music— not just the fashions— stretch the boundaries of what “music” even is? Not so much.

I can think of only a couple of acts in the Hall like this, whose music is abstract, unpredictable, left-field… just plain weird.

Then again, maybe such acts don’t belong in a hall of fame. Maybe the simple fact of their incomprehensible unapproachability keeps them being niche acts with relatively few, if ardent, fans.

Still, it would be nice to have a few more of the most influential ones in there. Putting some more in the Hall would certainly raise the profile of those artists…

And what is rock music, if not a series of sounds that raise an eyebrow or two?

Update: In 2023 eyebrow-raiser Missy Elliott was Inducted as a performer. 

The Women Issue

Yeah, yeah…. You knew we were eventually going to get to this.

Here we go: There aren’t enough women Inductees.

In one category, they are shut out almost entirely: The Award for Musical Excellence, formerly Sidemen. It might as well still be called Sidemen, because only one Sidewoman— Patty Scialfa, a member of the E Street Band (which, first, should have been inducted as Performers with Springsteen or at least by itself in 2012 along with several other “backing bands” that got full Induction)— is in.

I can think of many women who deserve to be here. If you can’t, please watch the documentary Twenty Feet from Stardom. And then see the 2008 doc The Wrecking Crew and meet Carol Kaye. In any case, there are many women who have backed big-deal acts in the studio and on tour for decades, often as singers but even as musicians (like bassist Kaye). It should be easy to find dozens of worthy candidates, and yet here we are, and here they aren’t.

The next most glaring category in this regard is the Ertegun (Non-Performers) Award.  There are 50 winners (as of 2020), all of three of whom are women. And all of those are inducted alongside a man… and as part of a songwriting duo: Mann and Weil, Goffin and King, Greenwich and Barry. Not as “producers, disc jockeys, record executives, journalists and other industry professional(s).” Even though women have, um, been those things.

Yes, this reflects the sausage-fest reality of the music industry. No, you can’t award who’s not there. Yes, it’s hardly the fault of the award that this has been the sad history of the industry.

But come on. Since 1986, there haven’t been one or two women “producers, disc jockeys, record executives, journalists [or] other industry professional(s)” deemed worthy of the award? Even looking back at the entire history of rock, which goes back some 70 years at this point?

None? Zero? Zilch?

Early Influences, you’re next. Seven out of 33. We’re talking about performers from, more or less, the 1920s to the early 1950s. Guess what? Women were performing back then, too. In all the genres that fed into rock. But only a fifth of these Inductees are female acts. Even accounting for the sexism of those days, they should be around 40%, not 20%, of this category.

OK, now for the Performers. There have been other websites crunching the figures here, but I’m going to take a different approach, closer to the Bechdel Test for women in movies.

We’re going to see if there are any years in which more than two women got inducted as Performers in the same year:

In 1988, three women got in, but all were Supremes, so three women but one act got in.

1998 (ten years later): Four women in two acts; this time each act (Fleetwood Mac, The Mamas and the Papas) had two women.

The following year, 1999, The Staples Singers made for three of the four women who got in, so still two acts.

That also happened in 2007 (eight years later). Four women got in…but three were Ronettes, so again only two acts.

And in 2013, three women got inducted in the same year. Two were in the same band (Heart). So three women, but again only two acts.

So… did it ever happen that three or more different acts, each one with female members, got inducted in the same year?

Yes. Once. In 1996— after 10 years of inductions… and not since, in almost 25 more years of inductions.

In that year, Gladys Knight and the Pips, Grace Slick (with Jefferson Airplane), Maureen Tucker (with Velvet Underground) and all four Shirelles were inducted. So, seven women inducted as Performers in one year..!

Along with 19 men.

I found at least nine years in which no female Performers were inducted at all. There were zero years in which no male Performers were inducted at all.

Have men simply been the ones more “allowed” to make music in all that time? Maybe. But… given all the music that gets in? I mean, think about how wide a variety we are talking about here, from disco to punk, from folk to rap.

Women are slightly more than half the population. Given the historic sexism of the music industry, maybe allowances have to be made. You can’t award someone who wasn’t there.

But to say that there are simply no women worth inducting in some years? And only one or two the rest of the time? Impossible.

There are many lists online of women who are both eligible and deserving. In 2021, everyone who dropped their first album in or before 1996 will be eligible, Maybe not enough women were making records in the very early days (which I doubt), but by the mid-1960s, they had likely caught up. At this point, there is really no excuse. There aren’t enough women Inductees.

“When you know better, do better,” said a great singer (and poet, and author…), Maya Angelou. So, Rock Hall… do better.

https://www.npr.org/2020/01/15/796717978/41-women-who-should-be-in-the-rock-roll-hall-of-fame

Update: They did better! 

In 2021, three different acts with women were Inducted as Performers: The Go-Go's, Tina Tuner (solo this time) and Carole King (both solo this time and as Performer this time). Several other women were nominated, as well.

In 2022, four different acts with women in them were Inducted as Performers: Pat Benatar, Dolly Parton (yes, really!), the Eurythmics with Annie Lennox, and Carly Simon. Additionally, folkie Elizabeth Cotten got in as an Early Influence and there was even a women winning the Ertegun-- Sylvia Robinson. 

This is very gratifying and heartening. Keep it up! 

2023 was another banner year for women: as Performers, Kate Bush (after several tries), Sheryl Crow and Missy Elliott. None in the other categories, but three women with very different styles all in one year should be the norm. 

The One That Rankles the Most (Updated: She got in!)

[I originally published this post before its subject was inducted, which she was in 2021.]

I promised myself that I would not discuss specific or individual acts, but keep this blog about genres and subgenres which are unfairly (if they are) excluded from the Rock Hall.

But there is one person I really feel I need to talk about: Tina Turner.

Yes, she is inducted, but as part of a doubles act—  with Ike.

And I feel that she more than deserves an individual induction for her much-longer solo career. Now, that’s true of several other acts who are also in only as part of a band, and not as solo artists.

What is specifically upsetting in Turner’s case is her well-known mistreatment by Ike. And it is beyond upsetting to me that she had to work as hard as she did to be free of him… only to find her name linked to his, for eternity, in the annals of the Hall.

Inducting Tina Turner as a solo artist would send a very clear message that the Hall recognizes her as a person, as an artist with boatloads of talent and sterling integrity.

The Hall already has received a lot of criticism for not including more women. Tina Turner is a shoo-in. She is universally beloved. She had a bio-pic movie way before some of the other Inductees. And she lives in Europe, so her induction would be worldwide news. She's already in her 80s, so the clock is ticking loudly here.

If you want ratings for your Induction broadcasts, I bet you could get Oprah, an avowed fan, to induct her. In case you needed more incentive to right this wrong, or to induce Turner to fly from Switzerland to the States for a statuette.

Update: Turner has been nominated for solo induction for 2021. 

https://ultimateclassicrock.com/tina-turner-should-be-in-the-rock-hall/

Update: She got Inducted in 2021! At least she was alive to know about it.

This documentary was released prior to her Induction, and no doubt helped that Induction happen: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt8399720/

Also, she won the Fan Vote. I will have to see how much this, historically, has helped acts get Inducted, but I doubt it could hurt: https://www.vulture.com/2021/05/tina-turner-wins-2021-rock-and-roll-hall-of-fame-fan-vote.html

The Case (Study) of KISS

While this blog is not about the merit of this or that act, the reasons KISS was Inducted are worth discussing, because they could help other bands (and genres) under the same situation. 

KISS was one of the most contentious inductions to the Rock Hall. The Hall seemed dead set on keeping them out… and yet, they did get inducted. Eligible since 2000, they did not get in until 2014, with only one other nomination along the way, in 2010— a decade after they were first eligible. 

I feel that there are two factors at work here, neither of which have to do with the quality of KISS’s music. They both have to do with the fact that the Hall is also a Museum. It’s right there in the full name of the place: The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and Museum.

The Museum set itself up, from the get-go, to embody a huge oxymoron; they want you to come see what you ordinarily only hear: music. So they have to have some things, some physical objects, to put in the displays, right?

And, say what you will about their musicality, few bands are a visually arresting as KISS. What are you going to display about, say, Nirvana? A flannel shirt? A notebook? With KISS, you have a guitar shaped like an executioner’s axe, and sky-high boots with skulls on the toes. Those, my friend, are some museum-quality artifacts worth selling tickets for.

Further, as a Museum, they need to sell tickets to stay open. And when tens of thousands of people— who call themselves an “army,” no less—  say they will not buy a ticket until you do a thing, but they will when you do do the thing, well… after a few years, you start to wonder if doing that thing just might be worth it.

TIME magazine once asked Spinal Tap to explain their longevity. They responded, and I’m paraphrasing: “We weren’t the strongest. We weren’t the smartest. But we were the loudest.” 

So there’s your lesson from KISS. You want your favorite band or genre in? Get organized, get stubborn... and get loud.

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/tom-morello-salutes-kiss-army-in-rock-hall-induction-speech-244529/